Rising from the Dead... or not as the case may be

[jdotmi]

Well, it would seem that there is a reprieve in the air for lisastall. templar_rose has indicated that game will be starting back up. It will be a smaller crowd, but it will be there. He's given me my invite and other invites will be going out. No more out-of-control games of doom.

So far, I'm bringing back Lisa Stall and Deirdra Smith/Morrighan. I will probably bring back Miranda, but I'm not sure. Bei-Ling and Arishayar are on hold for now.


White Wolf released Gehenna this week. I am going to The Underworld in Ann Arbor to see if they have it today. Thus begins the "End of the World" as we know it. We (satyr_mi and myself) will complete our World of Darkness collections and see where things go from there. I'm not sure I will care to continue purchasing WoD material with the revamp they are doing. Just from reading excerpts on White Wolf's official website I can see that they are continuing their trend of steamrolling a storyline over their customers. If this were graphic novels or plain old fiction I wouldn't care, but when you pull this shit in an RPG it pisses me off.

It's something that has been avoided, although not completely eliminated, in Dungeons & Dragons products. Then again, they have story changes when they change game editions. Seeing as how Advanced Dungeons & Dragons is just now on 3.5 (which did not contain major story changes in all reality) after how many years? White Wolf has a bad habit of making major game-world changes with every book, or at least every hard-cover, that comes out.

Now, you might (and I know some of you will) say, "Oh you don't have to use it if you don't like it" to which I respond "Bull-fucking-shit!" What, I'm allowed to ignore such ass-backwards things as the Avatar Storm, which while having a perfectly valid "story line" reason for existing was put in purely to break Mages in a way that they cannot recover from. You destroy the usefulness of the Spirit sphere (because any power which crosses the Gauntlet, even in a sensory fashion, subjects the Mage to damage from the storm) and thereby cripple 1/9th of theme and tone of the game-line. And how 'bout that Ravnos bit, which, by the way, I'm guessing is how ALL the Vampire Clans are going to get it shortly. Go read the previews on White Wolf's website if you don't believe me. It's spelled out in neat little black and white letters. Of course, this portion of my rant may be amended upon reading the book, but who knows.

The kicker is that the stuff in Gehenna happens regardless of the players actions. It even says in the book that the players cannot prevent it from occuring, so let them spend all the XP they have and, basically, "put their affairs in order". You lose the tone of a horror game when you tell the players "there is no way for you to survive or win or stop this". All good horror has a "ray of hope" regardless of the eventual outcome. Really good horror plays it to the fullest before destroying the characters.

So. Now we get to see how everything falls into place. Only time will tell if it was worth it.

Oh, look. A sappy splash page on White Wolf's website. Excuse me while I vomit.


Cross-Posted, with minor edits, to lisastall

Comments

[mightyafrodite.livejournal.com]

Ah, so basically they're completely destroying the games of the WOD? I know they've already destroyed the Wraith world in the cannon...at least that's what I've been told.

In the Mage game I'm in, we don't really go be the storyline that White Wolf has set up. We use the mechanics and the limitations that are in the game, but the reality itself is the GM's total creation.

[jdotmi.livejournal.com]

Well, I was just on White Wolf's forums...

**spoilers**
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Basically all the Vampires die. Lillith defeats Caine. Everything just withers and dies or is consumed and dies or just plain dies dies.

**/spoilers.

[n8an.livejournal.com]

Don't sugar coat it, tell me how you really feel.

;)

For what it's worth, I completely agree - I gave up on WhiteWolf quite a while back, for pretty much the same reasons - to play it all and still enjoy it, we had to ignore half of what was in the book, and that started to rankle somewhat. I overcame my completionist obsession and bought no more from 'em.

No XP burning for me. ;)

'Nathan

[jdotmi.livejournal.com]

We're going to complete our set and then my attitude is "fuck 'em" and not buying any more.

Whether or not I will actually be able to do said thing is another story.

[n8an.livejournal.com]

I have to admit some curiosity. I jumped off with the death of the Ravnos clan stuff (tm), what did they do the Mages and Wraith and Werewolf, etc? How about Changeling?

[jdotmi.livejournal.com]

Wraith went buh bye ages ago. Great Maelstrom destroyed much of the shadowlands, what's-his-face returned, yadda yadda yadda. The death of Wraith brought about Hunter. Changeling has been on hiatus because the WW folk are morons and can't manage the material. Mage is ending in two months, Werewolf in one month, Changeling/Hunter/Demon/Kindred of the East/Mummy at the same time as Mage. That last set all wind up having a book together and each gets the equivelant to a "tribebook" sized playout.

Stupid. Stupid. Stupid.

Nah. I'm not annoyed by it at all.

[mightyafrodite.livejournal.com]

I don't even bother. I've found a few concepts I enjoy, and other than changes in some of hte mechanics and rules, I and the people I game with haven't followed the WOD cannon one iota.

[n8an.livejournal.com]

Bleh. That all leaves a bad taste. Thanks for the precis. Now I need not botherto research. ;) I need to get my ass in gear today and pull my tree down. Christmas Tree #3 I'll have pulled down. This has been the most annoying Christmas ever.

On the other hand, my latest D&D Minis pack had a dwarven were-bear in it. :)

[mr-wes.livejournal.com]

Blah. I had even once toyed with the idea of playing again to have some fun RP but I quickly changed my mind when WW first launched their end of the world campaign. I was like, "what's the point?" I'm still trying to find an independent group in DC to hook up with.

[jdotmi.livejournal.com]

Oh yeah. Definitely. My Tremere sure as hell ain't goin' down. She's almost her own bloodline, and she's nearly totally insane to boot. :-p Fuck Lilith and Caine. She'll diab them to take 'em out of the picture.

[jdotmi.livejournal.com]

Oooohhh. D&D. I haven't looked at any of the Mini's stuff yet... I probably should... Especially since I'm vaguely seriously considering running a game. :-p

[jdotmi.livejournal.com]

I know. I was so annoyed when they announced the Time Of Judgement!!!1!11!!##@#@!!!

Fuck that shit. ~_~

I'm very lucky that I have a lot of local gamer friends. Very very lucky indeed.

[wyrdgurl.livejournal.com]

In my troupe game I run, we dont go by any of that stuff..there has been no end of the world, and all my players are very happy,

[jdotmi.livejournal.com]

Yeah. I just think it's sad you have to ignore the published material in order to enjoy the game.

[n8an.livejournal.com]

They're pretty decent, especially for someone who hung up my brushes and paints years ago. The only caveat is that I suggest you only ever buy one entry pack - the tiles aren't super useful, but more importantly, you only get one rare figure in the big box (which has twice as many figures as the booster boxes). So buying two smaller packs gets you 2 rares, and one more uncommon, than buying one box of the big starter sets...

...and given that I've already got more than four of some of the common figures(how many kuo-toa do you need?), I'm not doing the entry-pack thing again.

[jdotmi.livejournal.com]

Hehe. See, I'm not really into them for the actual playing of Miniatures or any of the collectible crap. I want them to do my battle / adventure layouts with. :-p The fact they're treating it almost like a CCG is sorta silly.

[n8an.livejournal.com]

Oh, we only use 'em for represeting figures in a battle, too. The game of Minis is sort of.. bland, actually. We tried it once, gave up at once. But there are a few figures I really want to get (Fire elemental, for one), that have me bending my budget a bit to invest. Grr.

But the ratio of rare:uncommon:common is way off. I've bought two packages of the 8-figure boosters for Dragoneye, and already I have doubles of two figures (though, in the case of the dwarven were-bear, it's not like it's a burden). But I already had 5 kobolds from the first set, now I have 2 kobold skirmishers to add to the mix. I don't think my game has ever had a kobold in it so far (mind, it's a very urban campaign so far...)

[mr-wes.livejournal.com]

You just said a cotton pick'n mouthful.

[jdotmi.livejournal.com]

I know for a fact I would need Goblins and Orcs a-plenty. I like using Orcs. And Hobgoblins. Kobolds not so much.

When I finally run my game, I will be starting at rock-bottom 1st level. I'm thinking a level every two or three adventures. I tend to be fairly episodic with a couple threads arcing throughout. I like to be able to sit at the table, game, and be done with the adventure in one sitting with maybe some loose ends to deal with during the next game.

I probably will just wind up using Dice like I always have. :-p

[n8an.livejournal.com]

I already have a dozen orcs, so you'll be right set there.

I tend to run campaigns on three levels: the over-reaching storyline arc, which the characters bump into now and then, and slowly begin to influence.

The short arcs, which are more like 'adventures,' and tend to wrap up in one or two or three sessions.

The character arcs, where I try to put a story into effect for each character, and have it bump into the other stories, in good (or bad) ways that help, hinder, or just add colour to the storyline (ie: the PC Sorceror/Fighter, who is a noble-born, has a brother who is borderline alcoholic and seems to have hired a witch-hunter to see who killed their cousin; the PC Rogue/Abjurer, whose master was murdered when she joined the rest of the group, and whois always on the lookout for the master's ring, which was stolen during the murder... etc).

So, while they're all about finding who is corrupting/creating evil murderous items and loosing them on the city, they're also hip-deep in a turf war between the Streetfox thieves guild and Bladethieves guild, trying to keep the Abjurer/Rogue and the Sorceror/Fightersafe from the witch hunters of the city (the entire kingdom is very arcane-negative), locate the Monk's brother, and restore the Druid's grove.

Ahhh, twisty plots.

[jdotmi.livejournal.com]

I think the most memorable character moments I've had in game were totally unexpected. Like the time a player character fell in love with an Elf Maiden they had rescued who turned out to be the Avatar of the Goddess of Elves.

Or the time when the player had his loyal pet dog, who everyone else thought was a wolf, who turned out to be a way distant cousin who wanted to have his children. (Mage game. She was a Werewolf who wanted to breed true or some such.)

[jdotmi.livejournal.com]

Hehe. Well, it's the truth!

I mean, you can use most of it, you just have to ignore all the storyline. All of it. And the NPCs. All of them.

Very annoying.

[n8an.livejournal.com]

Heh. In the current campaign I'm playing, the 'artifact' they're currently after catching is a sword scabbard that belonged to a hero from four hundred years hence. His spirit has been tied to it, and the owner of the scabbard uses him to go kill, wherein all the skill of the person killed in swordplay gets transferred to the blade currently in the scabbard, which the owner then uses quite quite well until the next time he kills something with it.

Anyway, originally, the ghost of the hero was just going to be a bit of a puppet ghost sort, though solid, but when the Fighter/Sorceror ducked into an inn when she wondered if she was being followed, the ghost followed, and an annoying suitor of the lady was monopolizing her. Her player asked me, "Is there a handsome, strong, rough-and-tumble sort anywhere in this room?" and so I aimed her at the ghost, and she flirted just to get the suitor off her back (her noble mother is always trying to marry her off), and the role-playing that ensued turned the ghost into a love interest...

...quick re-write, and the ghost is an unwilling enslaved ghost to his scabbard, and though he cannot betray his owner/user in any way, he does his best to only murder scoundrels on the user's behalf.

And, since he doesn't exactly live anywhere, he always just shows up wherever she is, and says, "I can find you whenever I want to," in a mysterious/cute way that absolutely no one in the group ever thought of until last session, when...

The user is aware of the Fighter/Sorceror, and the love interest/ghost has just been told, outright, to go kill her.

...trying to track down the killer that keeps slaughtering swordsmen, Fighter/Sorceror went home and in her room, holding the blade, is her suitor, unhappy with his bloodstained sword, and he says, "I can find you whenever I want to," and then raced at her.

Best fade-to-black we'd had in weeks. The whole group turned to me and yelled, "What?!"

Eep. Longwinded way of saying "Yeah, I love those plot wrinkles, planned or nay."

[mat-t.livejournal.com]

Yeah, very lucky. I don't have a single gamer friend around here. All of my gamer friends are online. I used to play in an IRC WoD game, but it sort of fell apart when people's schedules got different and erratic enough that we couldn't schedule sessions anymore. *sigh* I miss gaming.

Not *quite* true...

[paeryn.livejournal.com]

*SPOILERY SPOILING SPOILERS*
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The Gehenna HC displays 4 different scenarios. One sortof describes what you said...but there are three others. There are plug-and-play portions to each that are "optional", and a chapter/epilogue at the end encouraging you to blend any of the 4 OR make up something new OR do all of the above. I'm not defending WW--but my biggest criticism of the book is that if anything it's a bit TOO open-ended. Let me know what you think when you read it.

Re: Not *quite* true...

[jdotmi.livejournal.com]

Having just glanced through it...

...it's a crock of shit. It's big bang for the buck, but it's still a crock of shit. I'll post more on it after I have a chance to really dig into it.

[xiombarg.livejournal.com]

Amen, brother.

And let's hope that with the metaplot-free WoD 2.0, there can be White Wolf books that you don't have to disregard half of.

And amen to exposing the myth that the metaplot is "easy to ignore". When it's woven into tons of stuff, it's painful to re-educate every new player that comes along.

[jdotmi.livejournal.com]

One can hope. I'm not holding my breath, but one can hope...

What I'd really like to see is a World of Darkness with the splat setups, and then some settings where Things Can Happen. Best of both worlds, really.